Stop Retiring This Way


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Transcript

Mike:

Using a risk tolerance questionnaire to establish a retirement income strategy is akin to your doctor, checking your pulse to measure your cholesterol. Hey, there’s nothing wrong with checking your pulse, but it is an inappropriate test for the situation.

Zach:

Welcome to retirement today. I’m your cohost, Zach Holcomb. And alongside me, we have Michael Reese, founder and president of Centennial advisors headquartered right here in the beautiful city of Austin, Texas, Mike, super pumped for today’s show. But first of all, how are you today?

Mike:

Doing fantastic is always, how are you? Not right before,

Zach:

Before we get started, I want to talk about what you handed me before we walked into the studio here this evening, you handed me this article and you said, Zach, we absolutely have to talk about this because it is groundbreaking stuff,

Mike:

Right? It’s an article written by this guy named Wade fowl. Now, if you don’t know who he is, which odds are exceptionally high, that you have no idea who this guy is. Right?

Zach:

But if you do, you’re probably so pumped right now. That’s

Mike:

Right. Wait is known as in the fine in financial circles as probably the expert, like the go-to expert when it comes to how to structure your money for retirement income. So if you’re curious, you know, how should I structure money for retirement income? Wade is the expert. He has studied every path possible to do

Zach:

This. So his word is like scripture,

Mike:

Basically the financial advisory world, right? And he wrote this article. The title of the article is why risk tolerance, questionnaires don’t work for determining retirement strategies. Now, why is this such an important article? So let’s, let’s start here. So Zach let’s imagine now you’re young. You’re only like 27 or 28 or something 27, but let’s imagine that you were, I don’t know, 57 or 63 years old or something, right? Maybe the age of your parents. I don’t know how old your parents are, but maybe close to that. You’re sitting there. You’re thinking, you know what I’m thinking. I want to retire at least that at least you might be thinking you want work to be optional. Maybe you’ll keep working, but you just want financially speaking work to be optional working because you want to not because you have to sounds pretty nice. And so you think to yourself, you know, maybe you’ve been managing your own 401k money for all these years and it’s been growing and growing, but you’re sitting there and you’re thinking to yourself, gosh, you know, if I’m, if I know how to manage my money to grow, but how do I manage it to generate income in retirement?

Mike:

And how do I make it last right. Forever. Like for my whole lifetime, how do I make my money last? How can I, and you might not know how to do that. If you’ve been managing your 401k over all these years, that’s very common. It’s like, you know how to make it grow, but how do you make it last? When you’re starting to take income, right? It’s a big transition in your life you’ve got to make and you start going out and you start talking to different financial advisors. And you especially like to talk to the ones maybe at these really big firms. Right. Because I know them, I recognize the name. I’m comfortable with that. Yeah. It’s like, oh, there’s a, I know that company they’ve got an office. It seems like on the corner of every, of every block or, yeah, I know that company.

Mike:

They’re a big wall street firm. And anyway, they’re big. So you’re like, okay, they must know what they’re doing. So you go in there and you talk to the advisor and the advisor seems very nice. They all are. And when one of the first things that they’re going to have you do in order for them to help you, they’re going to ask you to complete some type of risk profile questionnaire or risk tolerance questionnaire. And this is a questionnaire that basically the purpose of it is to find out, well, how much risk are you willing to take with your investments? Right? And so, and by the way, everybody knows what these things are. If you’ve ever talked, spoken to a financial advisor at a big firm, you’ve had a risk tolerance questionnaire, right? They’ve asked you questions like, Hey, here’s how long do you expect the money to be invested?

Mike:

How much volatility are you comfortable handling? You know, Hey, the market, you know, here’s a potential series of portfolios. You know, each one makes a little bit more return over time, but it takes on more risk over time, which portfolio, which trade-off between risk and return. Are you comfortable with these are risk tolerance, questionnaires. They are standard documents in the financial industry. You can find them online too. I’m sure I could just Google it and take one. Like in seconds, if you open up an account at Vanguard or fidelity, they give you the option of, Hey, you want us to help you build a portfolio? Fill out this risk tolerance questionnaire. Yep. So here we have the standard document and in the industry, the way it works is that advisors use your answers on these risk tolerance, questionnaires to build your portfolio, right?

Mike:

And so the idea is, oh, answer these questions. We can build a customized portfolio for you. And if you’re dealing with a big firm, that’s a blatant lie is because they have like maybe six different portfolios they use. And everybody gets the same ones, right? Regardless, but here is wait, our retirement income expert in the country. And here’s what the title of this article is that came out September 21st. It says, Hey, heads up. These things are worthless. When it comes to retirement planning. In fact, here is the first sentence. This is the first sentence in this article using a risk tolerance questionnaire to establish a retirement income strategy is akin to your doctor, checking your pulse to measure your cholesterol. Hey, there’s nothing wrong with checking your pulse, but it is an inappropriate test for the situation. In other words, what is Wade saying? Here you go, Zach.

Mike:

And our little, you’re getting close to retirement. You go see these advisors. They get the minute they give you a risk tolerance questionnaire immediately. According to Wade, the expert of all things, retirement income planning, according to him, it’s like, all right, that just told you that your advisor is the wrong advisor to help you with your retirement. Yeah. They’re not giving me what I actually need. Yeah. It’s like, it’s like, if you went to a doctor and you said, Hey, my arm’s broken. And the next thing you know, they’re saying, well, first thing we better do is check your legs to make sure they’re okay. I look at those feet. Yeah. Let’s, let’s, let’s do some kind of an x-ray on your, on your ankle, you know, right away. The doctors. No good. Not the doctor for me. Yeah. Well, that’s, what’s happening here. If you go to a financial advisor and they say, Hey and you tell them, I want to retire.

Mike:

I’m retired now. I want to retire soon. And your whole focus is how are you going to generate retirement income? If that’s your focus. And one of the first things they do is say, Hey, let’s do a risk tolerance questionnaire. You know, Hey, I’ve got a questionnaire for you and start asking questions about risk tolerance. You know, you’re in the wrong place, right? You’re in the wrong place. As in this article, as he talks about risk tolerance, questionnaires are not designed for retirement income strategies. They’re designed for the person that’s trying to grow their portfolio. So what he’s really saying here is, and think about it, Zach. We know when it comes to financial planning, you’ve got to make good choices about your money. And what, why do people invest money? Why do you invest money? I invest money for it to grow. Yeah. You invest money to grow.

Mike:

Right. And that’s great. And that’s what risk tolerance questionnaires are built for. They’re built to help you figure out how much risk can you handle while you’re growing your money while I’m in that accumulation phase. That’s exactly right. What they are not built to do, however, is help you figure out how to structure things. When it’s time to, you know, transition to a, Hey, I need to protect my principal phase. I need to generate income phase. Or we go from growth and accumulation to protection and income, right? They’re not designed for that stage of life. You know, there’s a whole section that’s titled why is investing during retirement different? I’ve learned that once you are about five years away, that’s kind of the magic period. Once you’re about five years away from retirement. And by the way, retirement might mean something different to you than it means to the next person.

Mike:

Right? Right. But once you’re about five years away from let’s, let’s make, let’s say retirement. What if I said from the point where work becomes optional, right? Let’s maybe think about it along those lines. That’s when you really need to start transitioning into this mode of thinking. So Wade tells us, he says, investing during retirement is different than accumulation. And I like this though. And I know you saw this because you pointed this out, right? So that’s the definition of retirement though, continues to be elusive. But whatever form it takes retirement is about a life transition. So I don’t want to go over that too quickly. When I say, if you’re within five years of retirement and then I said, really it’s are you within five years of work being optional? Right? That’s what he’s talking about here. Because for some people, retirement means that’s it I’m done.

Mike:

I’m going fishing. Right. But then others, you have, maybe they go work part-time or they consult, or maybe they come back to work in a few years. Yeah, exactly. But essentially it’s a true, it’s going back to the article waits as it’s a transitional way from being dependent on, you know, your work income basically to where the money you’ve saved starts generating income. And there’s a number of issues you need to think about. So this is the first time in your life when it comes to your investing, that you have to start considering things that are different and it’s a big change. It’s a big transition. Yeah. And what, what he talks about here is you got to think about, here are the, he calls them the three ELLs, ELLs, three ELLs, first owl, longevity, you know, how long are you going to live? Right.

Mike:

Let’s say you retire or make work optional. When you’re 62, how long does your money have to last? Well, if you’re married 30, 35 years, you know, these we’re all living longer. You know, I remember my dad, he retired when he was 62. This was back in, gosh, it was 20 19 99, 19 99. He was 62, 22 years ago. He’s now 84, 85. Now actually, I guess he’s 80. He just had his 85th birthday. Anyway, here’s the point. I remember when he turned 80, what did he say? I wish Calvin wish him happy birthday. He says, you know, Mike, I never expected to live this long. My father retired at a stage in life where the average life expectancy for a man was about 80. Now he’s 85. My mom’s 85. I guarantee you, my mother’s going live at least another 10 years. If you’re retiring today at 62, could you make it to a hundred? Odds are good that yeah, medical advances are gonna help us live

Zach:

Longer. My great-grandma was 102.

Mike:

Can you imagine now you’re retiring at 62 thinking, holy cow, my money’s got to last 40 years. What strategies are you using to make sure that your money lasts? And what Wade says is if you’re just using the old fashioned risk tolerance questionnaire, that doesn’t cut it. That will not work. You need more sophisticated strategies. So the first Dell longevity, the next owl, this is a big one. You’re ready for this.

Zach:

One’s actually a fun one. Yeah.

Mike:

Lifestyle. Ooh. So what he’s talking about here is, Hey, when it comes to your retirement, let’s say you choose to retire. There are certain basic expenses that you’re going to have the, you know, the traditional, whether they call it food, clothing, shelter, the needs, right? The basic needs who wants to retire to a retirement where, oh, all I have, all I can afford is food, clothing, shelter.

Zach:

I wouldn’t want to retire if that’s the case. No,

Mike:

You want to have, you want to be able to enjoy retirement. And there’s a certain lifestyle. So what happens is, and we have this conversation all the time with people, they say, Hey, I’m in my late fifties, early sixties. I want to retire at some point in the next five years. Okay. Let’s talk about what your lifestyle, you know, what is your target lifestyle? It almost doesn’t matter what you do. It’s going to cost money. Especially if you have grandchildren, you want to take them to dunk dunk, dunk,

Zach:

Disney, world Disney. Yes. I knew it. I hate to say,

Mike:

I mean, it’s a great place, but oh my gosh. They just, if there is no place on earth, it gouges you for money. Like

Zach:

The nickel and dime the second you step foot on their property. Oh

Mike:

My gosh. It’s horrible. Anyway, the point is it all costs money, right? Nobody wants to retire. If they’re at one lifestyle level and they have to reduce their lifestyle dramatically, nobody wants to do that. And so what Wade is talking about is, again, what kind of strategies are you using to create a stream of income that supports your lifestyle, that you don’t have to worry about what the market does? It doesn’t matter if the market goes up and down, all that matters is are you going to get that income to support your lifestyle? Yup. And then the last L is liquidity, right? You’ve got to have enough liquidity for dealing with family emergencies, home repairs. Hey, how about this long-term care, unexpected death or illness. That’s an issue that’s can be expensive. So do you have enough liquidity? One of the things that I tell people who are getting ready to retire is that they need to rethink their liquidity needs a little bit.

Mike:

So imagine, you know, you’ve probably heard this all the time. So Zach, you know, while we’re working, you and I are working and if you say, Hey, how much money do you need to have in emergency funds at the bank when you’re working almost every financial, anything, any article, any, anything you read, anything you watch, they all kind of say the same thing, three to six months of income, right? That’s what they say. Well, when you retired, I tell people, Hey, you want to bump that up? If you’re getting ready to retire, I want to see a year’s worth of income sitting at the bank. And yes, I know it stinks because it doesn’t make anything, but I want to see a year there. And the reason is this in retirement, things happen, oh, I’ve got you know, I’ve got two. My first one out, my air conditioning went out.

Mike:

That costs money. Hey, I want to my kid lost his job. I want to kind of loan him some money to kind of fill the gap. I want to buy a new car and I don’t want to finance it. There’s a lot of reasons that you need some extra liquidity when you’re in retirement. So I want you to think about retirement income and how it compares to when you’re working. So I had this discussion the other day. I had a couple that actually they extra came in the office and we were visiting. And we’re talking about this very issue and let’s, let’s call him John and Mary. Obviously I’m not going to give you their real names. Sure. But I just simply asked us, I said, John, you know, let’s, let’s kind of explore this together. So you’re working right now, correct?

Mike:

He’s yup. Been working. How long have you been working John? Oh, let’s see. Probably about 30 years now. All at the same company or? Well, no, I’m on my third company. I’m like, okay, great. How long have you been at this company? Well, 15 of those years. Okay. Fine. So let’s think about the company you’re at right now. Every couple of weeks they put something in your bank account. What do you call that? It’s a paycheck. He’s like, yeah, it’s the paycheck, right? That’s perfect. Zach, keep going. I’m gonna let you answer. I’ll bet you that you’ll answer the questions the same way he did. All right. So you’ll be John, right? John. So like, yeah, paycheck. That’s right. And, and by the way, is that come pretty regularly or do they just decide to skip them every now and then? Well, usually

Zach:

It’s twice a month. And when I say usually it’s, every time

Mike:

It’s like, it always, they don’t skip paychecks. And I mean, if they did, you’d probably leave right now if we think about it. So those paychecks they’re pretty consistent. They come every couple of weeks right now. Is your paycheck today? The same amount that it was when you started 15 years ago? Well, for me, it’s more like six years, but no, it’s not, but in John’s you’re supposed to be John here. Yes. The answer is true for John as well. Yeah, it was right. I mean, yeah, they’re basically bigger, right? I mean, now they’re larger because maybe you’ve gotten raises because of your work, maybe you’re promoted. But even if you worked, you probably every, you know, probably you got increases each year because of inflation. So here we have a stable and consistent paycheck coming to you from your employer. That’s growing over time, you know, to account for inflation other things.

Mike:

And is that work pretty well? Yeah, sure. Of course it has. So here’s my question. If that worked really well for you when you were working don’t you kind of want the same thing after you retire, be pretty nice, right? Where you, you have a check that comes to you regularly. Maybe it’s monthly instead of twice a month, but where it’s stable, it’s consistent not worrying about it, not showing up and it’s growing. Isn’t that? What we want a hundred percent. Oh, but wait a minute, wait a minute. Let’s back up. Okay. You were working during 2013, right? Yes. I mean, that was just, you know, a while back, you know, in 2013, the stock market was up like 32%. Did you know that it was getting some pretty good gains? So John, when the market was up 32%, did your company come to you?

Mike:

And they say, oh John, you won’t believe it. The stock market’s up like 30% this year, we’re going to give you, we’re going to increase your income by 30% because the market’s up 30%, did they do that? I wish they did, but they didn’t. No, they didn’t. Right. But on the other side of that coin in 2008, the market was down like 37% in 2008. Did they come? You go, ah, John, this is horrible. The market’s down 37%. Sorry, buddy. But we’re going to have to cut your paycheck by 37%. Did they do that? They didn’t know. I mean, it was basically the same number, you know, growing with inflation. Right? So the market had no impact on your paycheck when you were working. So again, once you retire don’t you kind of want the same thing. Absolutely. Your check’s coming to you. It doesn’t really matter if the market’s good or bad, it’s just coming to you all day. Okay. Last question. Hey John, how long now this was a conversation. Remember? I actually had with a real couple. How long do you want this to go on? I mean you figuring, okay. You’re retired. You’re paycheck, stable it’s comes every month. It’s growing the stock market. Good or bad. Doesn’t impact it. It just comes to you. How long do you want to keep being paid out to you? What do you think? What do you think? He said,

Zach:

John’s a pretty smart guy, but I bet he said not only as long as I live, but as long as my wife lives, ah,

Mike:

No wrong answer. John goes, well, as long as I live,

Zach:

Oh no, John. And

Mike:

I love it when guys do this because especially in front of our wives, because then I get to kind of stay, oh, that’s great, John. And I stop and kind of turn back to him. And I said, well, wait a minute, John, out of curiosity, who’s probably going to live longer. You or Mary? Probably married. And he’s like, he’s like yeah. I said, you maybe want to refresh or rethink how long you want that paycheck to last or that, that income to last. And he says, yeah, as long as both Mary and I are alive, as long as either one of us is alive, like yeah, I think that’s probably better. Right. I

Zach:

Was trying to make John seem like a really, really good guy, a real

Mike:

Smart guy. Right? Yeah. So anyway, I know, but here’s the thing. This is the challenge that Wade files talking about in this article. What he’s talking about is he saying here’s a problem. Number one, we have a problem that we don’t know how long John or Mary are gonna live. They could live 30, 40 years. That’s a long time that money has to last. So we don’t know how long you’re going to live. We don’t know what the stock market’s going to do. You know, when you look at a risk tolerance questionnaire, which is the traditional approach that the financial industry uses in order to determine your asset allocation, the purpose of that questionnaire is simple. It’s to figure out how much can you put in the market and stay invested in both good times and bad. But when it comes to retirement, you have a lot of stresses that impact those numbers.

Mike:

Because remember it’s what, and he does talk about this in the article. Remember when you’re just sitting there and you’re letting the money grow and you’re adding money. You don’t, I mean, good years, bad years, who cares, but when you’re pulling money out in the market, if the market happens to be down, you’re selling a bunch of shares at cheap prices to get your income. And before you know it, you started downward spout spiral, and you run out of money. You have to manage your money in retirement differently. You have to be smarter. You have to have more sophisticated strategies because just the same old, Hey, just build this portfolio and an asset allocation approach rebalanced once a year, but basically let it ride. That’s fine when you’re working, but it doesn’t work in retirement. So what weight’s talking about in this article, and this is really groundbreaking because it shatters everything that the financial industry thinks you should do.

Mike:

The financial industry thinks you should say, oh, let’s do a risk tolerance questionnaire. Let’s put together an appropriate asset allocation approach. And we’ll just take out income over time. That doesn’t work. It only works when the markets are going well, it doesn’t work in periods when the markets are not going well in our office, you know, this is an area we focused on in specialized for over 25 years. And we’ve utilized different strategies and more sophisticated strategies to separate your portfolio into income components and growth components. So as to resolve this very issue, that’s the kind of thing, the way it’s talking about. He’s like, look, you need to use more sophisticated strategies. Like what we’re using, not what the general, you know, financial industry uses. If you’re like John and Mary, where you say, Hey, when I was working, my income was stable. It was predictable.

Mike:

It would increase over time. A bit. The markets, the stock market did not affect me one way or the other. And that worked so well when I was working. I’d love to see the same thing when I’m retired. Okay? If that’s you, which by the way, it’s about all of us, then you need to recognize that retirement is a different stage of life. And guess what? You probably need to talk to a different financial advisor. Someone who specializes in that environment. So let’s imagine you’re either retired or you’re getting close. You ask your advisor, Hey, do you know who this weight foul guy is? And their response is no, I’m not, you know, rings a bell. Not really sure. I can look him up that tells you at his screaming, screaming red flag. You need new advisor. Now you need a new advisor immediately because your advisor does not have the expertise to help you at the stage of life.

Mike:

I mean, if they don’t know who Wade fowl is, then they have no clue, right? How retirement income works. And they’re dangerous to you at this stage of your life. And I’m sorry if I’m being a little direct on that one it’s reality folks. And remember, what’s our job here on the show is to give you the easiest way to enjoy financial prosperity, right? I want you to enjoy the three CS that I want you to have the confidence that you’re making the right financial decisions. I want you to have control of your taxes. We’re not really talking about taxes tonight. You know, if you listen to the show, we talk about it a lot. Pretty much every week. Yeah. Tonight, we’re more talking about how do you make sure that your money lasts? And then the third C is comfort the comfort and peace of mind that no matter what the risks are, the threats are out there.

Mike:

You know, market crashes, healthcare concerns, you know, maybe somebody dying too soon, want to make sure that you’re protected against those risks. So want you to be confident you’re making the right financial decisions control. You want to have that feeling of control when you deal with the IRS. And then finally the comfort and peace of mind that, you know, you’re protected no matter what the world throws at you. Yep. Tonight though, we’re talking about the confidence that your money’s going to last, you’re making the right choices. What Wade is talking about in this article is he saying, Hey, heads up. It’s like a, it’s like he’s throwing a torpedo into, right into the center of the battleship. That is the financial industry. And he’s sinking it. Cause he’s saying, look, this tree and this torpedo is hitting and it’s hitting like, it’s a perfectly placed shot because what he’s saying, he says, Hey, you guys wake up, you live and breathe.

Mike:

And everything, everything, the financial industry does revolves around a risk tolerance, questionnaire, everything. Every time you go to a big company, you need to fill one out or they can’t manage your money. It’s like, look, you need to fill this out so we can decide how to manage your money. What they really need it for by the way is when you Sue them because they lost more money that you ever thought you could lose. They can pull out that paper and say, oh no, you told us it was okay. This is what you said. Yeah. The classic CYA, right? For the compliance department. But here’s reality. The entire industry is built around this document. I mean, it started as a good idea, but here’s the thing it’s built for growth and accumulation. So if you’re at the stage of life, you’re in your twenties, your thirties, your forties, and all you’re trying to do is grow your portfolio.

Mike:

Weight is saying, that’s fine. Risk tolerance, questionnaires, they’re wonderful tools. They help you figure out how much risk you can take and stay invested in good times and bad. That’s fine. They work really well for that. But if you’re in your mid to late fifties where you’re saying, Hey, I’m going to be retiring in a few years, hopefully, or you’re in your sixties or seventies. Then these risk tolerance, questionnaires that the entire industry relies on. They’re not worth the paper that they’re on. They’re worthless. And what his, the point he makes in this article is he says, Hey, if you want to make sure your money lasts, if you want to have that first, see confidence that your money is going to last, as long as you do, then throw that risk tolerance, questionnaire away and find an advisor who specializes in this area. So they can help you make those smart decisions you need to make.

Mike:

And by the way here’s, here’s an interesting thing. He, from his perspective, he has studied, you know, how much income you can take. He has, you know, he he’s like, look, if you are someone that’s open to the idea of using annuities, then here’s how you do it. If you are not open to the idea of using annuities, well, then that’s how you do it. By the way, heads up, he is a huge proponent of annuities because his math, he doesn’t have a dog in the fight. His math tells loud and clear that whenever you include annuities as a portion of what you’re doing with your retirement income planning as a portion, not everything, a portion, then what happens is your income’s more stable. It’s more consistent. It’s a higher number. You get more income. And your ability to growth inflation is improved.

Mike:

There is in, in all of his research, he actually identifies, he says, there is no scenario where not including annuities is optimal. Interesting. It’s like every single time you look at creating retirement income, at least in today’s world, every single time, if you’re not including annuities as part of what you’re doing, then you’re missing the boat. You are absolutely making a mistake is what he would argue based on math. But really the question then becomes, okay, well, what kind of annuities and what makes most sense for you? Sure. There’s that, that opens up a whole different discussion. We don’t have time for, right. We should probably do a show just on that. Definitely. Right? Because we get all kinds of questions on annuities. Anyway, the point is this, when it comes to retirement income members, so income, stable, predictable inflation, protected. That’s the end game.

Mike:

You know, we had this discussion the other day, right? Zach, we were talking about why do we invest money? We do it to grow, to grow, but what’s the end game. Why do you want it to grow? How does it help you? How does it benefit you? I mean, let’s imagine you’re 65 years old and you’re like, wow, look, I got $2 million. Yay. Woo. How does that help you? I’ve got a big pot of money that I can make lasts now. The rest of my life. I hope. Yeah, but the question it’s not how big the pot of money is. It’s how much ongoing regular income that pot of money can generate for you. Yup. Right? What I rather have a piece of, let’s say you’re retired. Would you rather have a piece of real estate where $2 million that gives you 50,000 a year of net income?

Mike:

Or would you rather have a piece of real estate? That’s a hundred or $1.5 billion or 500,000 less, but it gives you a hundred thousand of income or double the income. I want the a hundred K income all day. Yeah, because you can’t spend, I mean, you spend income. Yeah. Right. That’s what you spend. So anyway, I know we gotta wrap the show up today. So here’s we want to do, if you are within five years of retirement or you’re already retired, now’s the time to take action. And we want to give you the easiest way, the easiest way to make sure that you’re making the right decisions so that your money lasts. All you have to do is give us a call. Let’s set up a 15 minute, you know, retirement income phone call, right? 15 minutes is all it is. It’s free. It’s easy. All you gotta do is call the number. You’ll reach our after hours, our answering service. And they’ll set up a 15 minute phone call with one of our advisors. There is no reason not to do this. Let’s make sure you’re making the right choices here. Zach, How do they get this phone call? I mean, why would you not do this?

Zach:

Mike? It’s super easy. All they have to do is reach out at (512) 886-5850. Again, that number is (512) 886-5850. All right, Mike, we got to wrap up, any final thoughts before we sign off?

Mike:

Yeah. Retirement should be the best time of your life. Make sure you’re making those smart financial choices so that your money supports your dreams. That’s our message. Folks have a great week. We’ll see you next week.

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